It’s all about confidence, communication and conviction

In this episode, we have Aarti Dabas with us -the Chief Media Officer for Formula E. Aarti shares insights into her unconventional path in sports, driven by a desire to challenge gender norms. As we delve into Aarti’s experiences at the International Cricket Council and her role at Formula E, the conversation explores the challenges women face in male-dominated industries. Aarti emphasizes the importance of self-belief, being shameless about seizing opportunities, and the need for women to be kinder to themselves. The episode unveils the multifaceted nature of Aarti’s career and her dedication to empowering women in sports. Tune in now!

Discussion Topics: It’s all about confidence, communication and conviction

• Introducing Aarti Dabas, Chief Media Officer for Formula E
• Aarti’s Role and Formula E: Focus on electric racing in iconic cities
• Aarti’s Journey into Sports: Early experiences in journalism
• Challenges in Women’s Representation in Sports: lack of female role models
• Importance of Networks and Allies
• Personal and Professional Challenges: Termination from a previous job
• Balancing Work and Personal Life: Importance of self-care
• Defining Success: Learning from failures, self-belief, and personal growth
• Advice for Young Women Leaders: Be shameless about opportunities
• Advice to Younger Self: Have more fun in life

Transcript: It’s all about confidence, communication and conviction

Ritu G. Mehrish: Hi Aarti, welcome to Rewrite The Rules podcast. I wanna do a quick intro for our audience. So Aarti is the Chief Media Officer for Formula E, and she will tell us what Formula E is. And before that, she held leadership roles at the ICC, which is International Cricket Council for all the cricket lovers out there, Aarti’s a strong believer in the power of sports to inspire and impact positive change in the society.

She’s also passionate about women empowerment and girl empowerment, even before we become women. And that’s the reason why we are having this conversation. Welcome again, Aarthi, would love to hear a little bit more about what you do now, and also your stint with ICC. I was very intrigued when I read that, so yeah. Share a little bit more.

Aarti Dabas: Thank you for having me on this platform Ritu. My role as Chief Media Officer is to ensure that the fans for the sport grow through all different platforms, and that is through broadcast distribution, and digital distribution, whether it’s gaming or any new platform. So I have a team, which includes technology, business, and insights. It’s got media rights, which is selling sports rights to different broadcasters around the world, producing live racing content, and producing original content behind the scenes.

And distributing across broadcast partners our own digital platforms, Facebook, etc. So in short, we produce content and we distribute it to attract more fans to the sport. Formula E is effectively, in a nutshell, the future of Motorsport. We are nine years old, so we are in the ninth season, and this is about electric racing in the streets and city centers of iconic cities in the world.

And the big thing about this is we know that the future of mobility is gonna be electric, right? Because that’s how it’s sustainable. But we are more than just about the environment. We are about how you make society sustainable and actually empowerment and women’s empowerment and girls empowerment that we talk about as part of it. But I think the biggest thing is we were based on a purpose.

Our founder had a great vision, and we are a ninth year of existence, and we are the future of Motorsport. In a few years time, hopefully not that long, three or five years, people will know formula is a dominant sport in the world.

Ritu G. Mehrish: Wow, this itself can be a topic. This is so fascinating because I’m sure to a lot of people this concept formula is still new. Aarti, what really got me intrigued when I read a little bit about you is, your foray into sports. Now, again, I’m not generalizing, I know there are a lot of women who play sports but still, I think about leadership roles in sports organizations. At least I haven’t heard, or I haven’t seen too many women. So tell us a little bit, how did you land up doing there? Did you always want to be here?

Aarti Dabas: No, interestingly, if you’d asked me this question 10 years ago, when I hadn’t thought so much about why I got into sports, my answer would be different. I do love sports, so it’s like I’m doing something I love doing.

I think the reason, this is a bit of a background. I am Indian, and my family is Indian. I have not been living in India for 20 years now because I worked with the ICC, which is headquartered in Dubai and before that for 10 sports. But I grew up in India. My dad was in the army. I would say the background that we came from was traditional, but my dad was a forward thinker in the family.

And I’m the first girl from the family to be working. We are two sisters. I’ve got an older sister and I think from a very young age, I generally saw where I existed. How boys were preferred over girls, And I think subconsciously, I eventually wanted to make a point.

I wanted to work in environments which had low female representations. So rather than say which were male dominant, I would say low female representation. And for me, the two ones that stuck out were sports because I love watching sports and the second was Army, cuz my father was in the Army.

I was like, I’ll join the army. But I think by the time I was 15 I was very clear that all I wanted to do was work, I just wanted financial independence. I didn’t want to take a penny from anybody. I didn’t want to spend time at home. I clearly remember this line.

My dad told me, never to step into the kitchen because you will never get out of it. So I think he was quite a visionary at that time. But that line, if I think about it today, I actually tell my daughter, you need to learn how to do things because it’s very different, right? The kitchen is not a place for a woman because in a home house, you see her parents equally, so I think it’s the background you come from. So that’s why I think The long answer to your question. I think there were a lot of factors, that’s why I ended up in sports.

Ritu G. Mehrish: So interestingly sports primarily has been, where women representation is not being great. even now though, we are trying, especially let’s say India or Asia overall. How was that journey?

Aarti Dabas: I actually did my graduation in journalism from Delhi University. We were the first batch of journalism students. Even then when I did my internship after the second year, I did it with Indian Express and I said, I want to join the sports desk. So I joined the sports desk.

I did a lot of satellite tennis tournaments and different things. Never got to do cricket. And eventually, my editor called me in and he said, do you want your byline? And I’m like, He’s like, then don’t work in sports because you won’t get a byline. It’ll take you years and years. So do you a byline is having your name published versus

Ritu G. Mehrish: Okay fresh news service.

Aarti Dabas: So I’m part of a larger service versus Art Deba by Art Deba. So I was like, obviously my name, and so in the final month, I had two months of internship cuz it was in the summer.

I went and covered all sorts of things so I finally got a byline and it was an opportunity cuz I was in the office early and there was a mortuary somewhere where dead bodies were thrown around and they had to find somebody to go and cover it, It was ironic.

I got my first byline for something, which was quite horrific actually. And then I finished my journalism. I went to Sophias in Mumbai to do mass communications, social communications, and media. I think that sort of changed my life a bit, it was like the whole course was about using media for socially relevant things.

People were standing up the first day. They’re like, we want to make educational programs, we want to do this. And there I stood up and I said, I wanna make sports programs. I can proudly talk about the impact that sports have on society.

Because it’s a massive impact. And especially on women and girls. It’s not about being an elite athlete. The reason I love that my daughter loves sports is the confidence it gives her. Just the teamwork things that she’s learning, just. All of that, I think girls and women, sometimes I feel don’t take risks, don’t do this. You’ll get hurt. It’s always a no. Rather than just go and try things. So I think sports have a massive impact on how they can empower girls and women in society, in life in general. I was at the suppliers and I was like, I wanna work in sports.

There were only two sports organizations in India. There was a sports channel, ESPN, Star Sports, but it didn’t do any production of its own, everything was outsourced from different production houses.

They used to produce tennis internationally based in, the US, and the UK. And I kept calling them for a month. And the receptionist finally put me through and I said, all I want is an internship. I wanna come and work. And eventually, after a month, I remember going to those STD booths and dialing from Bombay and, they said, okay, you can come and work for a month internship, but we won’t pay you, et cetera.

And I was thrilled, so I came back to Delhi, back living with my parents after a year. And, that’s how I started my internship after a month of the internship. They said, we don’t have a job to offer you. So I was back to square one for a couple of months.

I, almost out of desperation, was going into a PR job. And then he called me again saying, oh, we are starting some programs. Would you like to join us? And so that’s how my journey started. But I was talking about Sophia. I said, “Why have I changed my life? It was my first time away from home, a very intense course for a year with equally inspiring women. And just our HOD was strong and she literally made all of us cry once and it basically set me up for life. We used to work 20 hours, it was intensive sometimes sleeping in the college and public transport.

Bombay was like, I think I grew up as a person and because it was my decision, I’d got into ICC Delhi as well and Indian, but I wanted to go away from home. I just wanted to get away from home. So for the first three months, I remember I used to be an introvert and then, I dunno how I became an extrovert, but I think that one year was my defining moment.

So I stuck with it for three months and then eventually I think I found the confidence to, it was just great. And actually I’m in touch with each of those girls. We are in a group together and somebody was just saying she won an award for some. Amazing original program.

Somebody’s making films. Somebody’s a great journalist, and I think one thing that does tie us all together is that girls and women’s empowerment, it’s a really strong group. But I have to say one thing. You talk about women in leadership in sports. When I joined I M G T W I, there were such amazing women producers about five or six who worked in sport. None of them works now, and I keep saying this, that recruitment is a problem about opportunities, but retention is a bigger problem to retain women, as they go up and all of them have to leave, stop working for one reason or another because I’ll tell you about my story.

The only reason I could continue is because I have a very supportive network, whether it’s my husband who stopped working to allow me to work full-time, or it’s my parents and just colleagues that I’ve had. So I think that network is so important. Supportive network.

Ritu G. Mehrish: Great. Aarti.

Ritu G. Mehrish: I think what you shared was great. I loved your journey as you said. You went to prove a point to yourself and then you succeeded. When you started working what were some of the challenges that you faced?

Aarti Dabas: I think one of the challenges and I look back is I think I functioned like a man. I changed the way I behaved and I think I lost touch with my feminine self. Now as I’m older, I think about it. I wish I was allowed to feel like a woman.

It’s funny, I was allowed to feel a woman when there was some harassment happening. But otherwise, I had to be a man to survive in that world, which meant being a man, no vulnerability, no emotions, and always showing confidence.

Ultra confidence. I knew I had to speak louder than others to be heard, I think I also had harsher yardsticks that I was judged by, so for example, if I got an interview with a cricketer those days, SAG and, all these people used to play.

Domestic cricket, they were like, obviously it’s easy for her because she’s a woman. But actually, it was harder for me to go there and be surrounded. And it’s funny because all of these people are now my friends as well.

I think the other challenge for me was actually, I didn’t have any female role models or any women around me who were supporting me. Unfortunately, one of the things I’ve seen through my career is women have been competing with me. And I don’t know why that is the case, because maybe they feel there’s this small space and struggle to find women who are supportive.

In my previous job there were women on the board who’ve been CEOs and I reached out to them, but I didn’t get any support. I didn’t get any reaction. It was really disappointing. There are two kinds of women, women who fought hard to make their presence noticed in a largely male dominated world, but they are not there to help other women. They say, we’ve done it, so let them struggle. They like having the only seat on the table. And then others will bring others along in the journey. Saying more of us is better because it helps overall decision making, diverse everything, I hope it changes.

Ritu G. Mehrish: I can relate to some of the stuff you said because, in my work, we’ve often seen women not supporting women enough. And, my theory on that is, What you said is that sometimes women have fought so hard or worked so hard to get there, and sometimes they think that it’s because of the environment, right?

So they fought and they really worked hard to get there. And then one, either they are enjoying that space because they know only two women can be on that team. And therefore, there is this competitiveness that, I’ve got here.

Why should anybody else have it easy? Or I want to protect my space. But I think once the environment or the external factors change, once we start to see more and more women in those positions, that will change. Then we can bring up more women together and therefore then create that scene.

The other piece about role models, I run women’s leadership programs for corporations. Out of 10, 20 batches I’ve run 70 to 80% of participants in each batch will have a male as a role model. They’re not enough role models there. And it pains me a little bit. Having worked for about 25 years, I’m sure there have to be enough role models. And that’s part of the bigger thing that I’m trying to do, can we create more role models?

I think a lot doesn’t get said about women leaders. For example, let’s say you or other leaders whom I’m interviewing, it’s let’s get more stories out. Because when people see more, hear more. That’s when probably there’ll be more inspiration. Aarti, I wanna switch gears a little bit and come back to you. How did you go through some of these challenges? What were some of these steps you took?

Aarti Dabas: I’ve realized, and this is after again, you reach a certain age. After working for whatever, 24 years or 25 years, when you are in it, in the thick of it, I think I just didn’t stop. I just carried on. I wish when I look back, I wish I had allowed myself more time to develop. In different areas as a person. Because for me it was just work. I was there non stop working until I had my daughter, and then I struggled, as a mother, I’m like, what do I do for two years?

It was a struggle, because I was like, my God, I have to think about somebody else and not work. I think one of the things is I’ve realized, and this is probably introspectively, I never asked for help. I wish I’d asked for help because there were people who would’ve supported just being honest about the pressures you face. And the challenges you face every day, like whether you haven’t had a break for long, whether there’s something at home you have to deal with because ultimately it impacts your productivity.

And as women, we find it harder to talk about those issues. And I’ll give you an example. I was producing life cricket in Pakistan. So I first of all was like, no women on the crew except one, probably she was a director’s assistant or a member. So you’re in a crew with about 80 to a hundred men, right?

And I only got the opportunity cuz my male colleague had to go somewhere else, right? So they said, okay, they were not toilets for women. And then, it’s, it’s that time of the month and you’re like, okay, how do you, and there was nobody to talk to, but I think now I’m very open about those things and I think generally, The biology of a woman is very different to a guy, and I think we need to talk more about how we need spaces or workspaces that suit us.

When I had my daughter, I was already in a leadership position and I struggled. I had to stop breastfeeding and not because I would’ve stopped anyway. But when I went back to work, there was no place I could find, it’s tiny things, right?

But the point is that I don’t think the way things are set necessarily, inclusive. And I don’t mean go over the top, but actually see it from a woman’s point of view. And only a woman can see it from a woman’s point of view.

Aarti Dabas: I’m sometimes asked the question, why don’t you only do women’s sport? I’m like, no, but why can’t I do men’s sport? There has to be a balance between the two. You can’t just say, I’m a woman, do women’s sport and then men do the women’s sport.

Like it’s, the balance has to be right, because different perspectives draw. When I was young I didn’t know what was right and wrong. And, I wish I’d spoken up. Now I’m in a position where these things are coming to me and, and, I’m in a position to actually make fair decisions.

And when I look back, it had an impact. Like in my previous job I was asked to leave in a very bad manner. And I realized that women who lose jobs struggle to get new jobs as well because of networking. Our networks are not as big as men. I can’t just call a guy and maybe I can now at this level say, Hey, can catch up for a drink or catch up for dinner? Cause I have to think twice about it. What signal am I catching up for a drink or dinner? What does that actually mean? I dunno how the balance will ever come about.

But yeah, I would say that. Every big moment or incident that has happened in my life, I didn’t actually stop and deal with it. I just carried on because I thought I couldn’t take a break in life. So I think it’s really important that you find the network that you do when things are happening to you, find people to talk to and deal with those things emotionally you have a voice, use it if you’re ever uncomfortable or just use it to voice your opinions, what you feel. That is the most important lesson I could give anybody.

Ritu G. Mehrish: I think that’s such a good point. You know about, as you said, about feeling confident to speak up and I, my hope is that, from where we were in our journey to where things are now, the organizations and in general, I think women are. At least broadly, again, it’s not everyone, but are more empowered to at least speak up.

There was one thing that I did wanna talk about, and you mentioned a while back is about the support of people in your life. And you mentioned about your husband taking a break when you had your daughter. Tell me a little bit more, because I think that’s, again, an underrated opportunity or untapped opportunity. I think women don’t do enough of tapping into. Support systems exist and people do show up, but we just don’t ask enough. So tell us a little bit more about that.

Aarti Dabas: I think even growing up I was lucky enough to have parents who didn’t really force their choices on me. I remember I was 24 when I moved to Dubai and my dad was like, you’re coming back in a year and a half. And he never really pressured me and I think it was okay. It was okay. So I was lucky in that sense. And, my husband, he is 10 years older than me. He was quite well established.

He still is in what he did, he had a full-time job. And then we, when we decided to have our daughter, which is after I had a lot of health issues, He just said, look, I’m just gonna stop working. Irrespective of the fact we would’ve got house help and support, he’s a commentator. He writes books, sports books and different things.

And he said, look, I, because I said I can’t stop working, that’s my identity. I’ve, this is what has driven me in life and if I stop, I don’t know what I’m gonna do. And actually, he struggles to break through the mom’s network, which in itself is also a challenge, right? And I do talk about it, how do you encourage more dads to take an active role when they’re not let into these networks?

Aarti Dabas: I read somewhere you can choose three things out of five things to do every day. You can choose. Family, friends, exercise, work, and I’m forgetting the fifth one, and every day you can do three things. You can’t do all of them. And I think you just have to be comfortable about making trade offs in life. And the trade off we made was going from two salaries to one salary, but having the confidence that eventually in the long term, that’s the right decision and.

Aarti Dabas: He has been so supportive, he keeps telling me, you’re wasting, you should be CEO. Now. What are you doing? I think just his belief in me also helps me. So I think that is really important and I guess I got lucky because. The people who impact you most in life will be your family, will be your teachers, will be your friends. You can’t choose the family.

Aarti Dabas: You can choose who you partner with in life, and you can choose the network of friends. That’s your choice. And choose wisely by people who lift you and who don’t pull you down.

Ritu G. Mehrish: Correct. Aarti, you make such a great point about choosing the right partner. I’ve had few leaders tell me that women leaders who are quite successful say that their husbands supported them. So I’m glad you brought that up. Yesterday I was speaking to another leader and she talked about the need of building allies within the organization. How sometimes as women we don’t do enough of that.

And how sometimes they can come into support and can really sponsor us and build that visibility. So I’m glad you’re, you’re talking about that. Aarti, I wanna shift gears a little bit and ask you something more personal. Being such an overachiever, how do you define success? What does success mean to you? There is no one way to define success. I know when you’re saying overachiever stuff, I feel I still haven’t achieved anything, in my head.

Aarti Dabas: And I’ve been told like, be kinder to yourself because I think I’m not kinder. That’s another thing women need to do, by the way, is to be kinder to themselves and acknowledge that. I think success for me is how you learn from failures, which is really important. I could be pretty candid about a sack from my job. 12 years over there called into work one day, handed a termination notice. Never has happened in the history of that organization. Will never happen again.

Eventually that leader was asked to leave because of his behavior. But I actually think that was a defining moment in my life. And there was another harassment case that happened to me that was a defining moment, and it’s only because I’ve been able to think about, again, it’s like how do you convert challenges into opportunities?

I keep telling my niece sometimes I wait for what’s going to happen next because I think I learn a lot from those. For me, success is really. How you recover and can redefine yourself, on that growth tragedy or in life, because I am today, because of the sum total of the experiences I’ve had.

And that’s why for my daughter, I do think about what is gonna drive her? Do I need to find these things? But I think eventually she’ll find her own thing, right? I don’t have to try too hard. I keep telling her, I leave her with two funds. One is a nanny fund and one is a therapist fund because she needs both.

Ritu G. Mehrish: I like that.

Ritu G. Mehrish: You’ve given a lot of insights and you’ve said a lot of things that, maybe young women leaders and emerging women leaders can benefit from. What would you say, what are two things that leaders emerging, young, inspiring women leaders, what should they really be looking out for?

Aarti Dabas: I think because I work in sport, I’ve seen so many top athletes, male and female. The one thing I’ve learned is self-belief. Self belief is really important because that belief is what will drive you, which is, which comes from a lot of things.

Be kind to yourself, believe in what you are, what you can offer. Don’t let anybody else dim your light. You need to talk yourself up sometimes. So the belief is important because I think women more than men don’t have that belief. And the second thing I would say is, Ultimately people talk about luck and et cetera and stuff. I think ultimately the harder you work, the luckier you get and there’s no replacement for that. And I would say to all the young girls that our time has come and I’m a bit tired of people saying, there should not be quotas, places for women.

And I’m almost like, I actually don’t care if somebody’s calling me a diversity candidate in the leadership team. I don’t care. I still have to do the job, right? I have to deliver on a role. So I just think be pretty shameless about why getting opportunities are important and then it’s for you to make something of that opportunity. So again, don’t let anybody else dim your light, the belief. The hard work

Ritu G. Mehrish: yeah.

Aarti Dabas: Eventually your output will determine where you go. You’ll always have hiccups in life. Don’t find blame. Don’t blame things and don’t find reasons.

Ritu G. Mehrish: Great. my last question to you, looking back, if there was one advice you would have to a younger self, what would that be?

Aarti Dabas: Have more fun. I think I’ve always been a very serious child. Not that I was a topper all the time, never I think I was in the top 10, but not like always excelling right at the top. I look at my daughter, she’s found a passion in playing sports. I used to play sports, but I was quite, quite a lonely child and I wish I had more. Fun in life. I wish I had happy memories of my childhood, don’t get it.

Ritu G. Mehrish: Sure.

Aarti Dabas: I think I probably put a lot of pressure on myself. So it was very, like I knew I had to do something and which meant that I don’t think I’ve played as much. I don’t think I learned new skills as much, which now when I’m, I want to unwind, I have absolutely no idea what to do, because I don’t know how to have fun, like just live a life beyond just academics and work, and you need to have that as well.

Ritu G. Mehrish: Aarti, it was such a great conversation and I wish we could go on and on. Few things that I took away, there were lots actually I took away. But things that stood out for me, like this thing that you said about self-belief, right?

Just believe in what you’re saying. And don’t always look for external validation. But just carry on. I think that’s really a key message. Self believe, and I have seen women leaders need that somehow much more than men. Or even if men need it, they don’t project it that much.

But there is something there. The second takeaway for me was the fact that you said that it doesn’t matter whether you are part of the diversity candidate or a quota candidate, whatever, be shameless. And the reason why it stood out for me, because I know some women leaders I work with, they were like, yeah, sometimes we get this thing from our male counterparts saying, oh, you are part of this because of this, this, this, but I love the thing.

And I jokingly tell people that, it’s too bad. There’s gonna be some collateral damage when we try and rectify something which has been going on for a year. So I love the point of being shameless. And the third one is of course, be kind to yourself.

Sometimes I think as women leaders, we are just very harsh on ourselves. Those are my key takeaways apart from everything else that you said. Thank you so much once again for your time. It was such a pleasure having you, and I’m sure our listeners are gonna get a lot from you. So thank you so much, Artie.

Aarti Dabas: Great Ritu, thank you for the opportunity. I really enjoyed the discussion.

Our Guest: Aarti Dabas

Senior leader within the sports industry with over 20 years of experience in delivering strategies to drive sustainable growth, engage diverse fans and increase revenues.